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Perfect #9 Tank
Page 1 of 1
Perfect #9 Tank
Im a little confused here! The Jr. Satan plan calls for this Tank...The Wedge has to be pointing to the outside due to centrifical forces from what I understand.#1) The Pickup on this tank is on the top..#2) The Cox Medallion .15 is a gravity feed engine . #3) Do I position this tank so the pick stem is on the bottom??
http://brodak.com/fuel/fuel-tank/wedge-fuel-tank-2-oz.html
Would not a Tank like this be a better choice for the application??
http://brodak.com/fuel/fuel-tank/standard-vent-wide-wedge-fuel-tank-2-oz.html
http://brodak.com/fuel/fuel-tank/wedge-fuel-tank-2-oz.html
Would not a Tank like this be a better choice for the application??
http://brodak.com/fuel/fuel-tank/standard-vent-wide-wedge-fuel-tank-2-oz.html
ZACATTACK- Gold Member
- Posts : 328
Join date : 2012-04-15
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
Please forgive me if I assume your name is Zac. THis is good that the pickup is out the top and not the front. This is what I was initially trying to describe in my other posts. Most of the Perfect tanks had the pickup out the front of the tank. I was suggesting to move it to the top or bottom. The example I displayed in one of my pictures the other day was how I relocated the pickup. By no means was I trying to persuade you not to use the tank. I was just explaining the problems I encountered while trying to use one in my Combat Kitten. I was also explaining as to why I no longer penetrate the leading edge. Although, in both of my examples I pictured I did go through. I can't wait to see what the results are when your done. Like I said my friend is just getting the old silkspan off of his now and doing some rib repairs. It won't be long. Good luck, Ken
Ken Cook- Top Poster
- Posts : 5408
Join date : 2012-03-27
Location : pennsylvania
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
What do I do Ken?? Run it from the top? Flip it and run it from the bottom? Im confused here..Is there a clunk in these tanks? Why is it OK to have the pick up on the top..is gravity not a factor here? .I still do not understand why having that pickup in the middle is better then having it in the front?
ZACATTACK- Gold Member
- Posts : 328
Join date : 2012-04-15
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
OFF TOPIC... Can you Send pictures of the Combat Kitten Decals...I have the 2 in 1 Kit with no Decals and cannot find an image to the decals no matter what...Help!!...SOS!!
ZACATTACK- Gold Member
- Posts : 328
Join date : 2012-04-15
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
How about this Tank?? It looks like you could flip this over so the pick-up is on the bottom and the wedge facing outwards....Then again I do not understand the importance of having the pick-up on the Top or Bottom..
http://www.greathobbies.com/productinfo/?prod_id=BDKBH566
http://www.greathobbies.com/productinfo/?prod_id=BDKBH566
ZACATTACK- Gold Member
- Posts : 328
Join date : 2012-04-15
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
If you were pointing the plane out in front of you, the pickup would be located in the center of the tank on the right hand side. The pickup should be soldered to the inside of the tank in that location. Perfect company didn't always do that for you. Were going to assume it's there. Where it exits the tank isn't as important as to where it is in the tank itself. A trick that combat guys would do was to cut an angle on the pickup where it would be soldered in that back corner. The stock tank is more than likely just cut square. We like to keep the angle facing the corner rather than facing into the open tank. Am I making sense ? I would just try the tank as is for now. Place the tank into your model. The fuel line is going to do the loopy going up and then under the cylinder head like the one pic you showed. I would use caution as the cylinder could burn the line. try to keep that fuel line as short as possible. I myself would probably replace the pickup with copper as this would give me the fuzzy feeling that I know the brass won't crack and that it's soldered correctly. It also gives me the opportunity to check to see that there is no corrosion inside. When you shake the tank do you little tinny rattling things inside? If so I would surely take that tank apart. Ken
Ken Cook- Top Poster
- Posts : 5408
Join date : 2012-03-27
Location : pennsylvania
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
I just looked at the link you posted. They're showing that tank upside down. That tank is meant to be mounted for instance on a profile for example. The would mean the tank would need to be flipped and this would place the exit of the pickup on the bottom. You can't just flip flop these tanks unless you resolder the pickup internally to the correct side. This tank is the same as the Perfect wedge you just bought. It's going to work I promise. I myself would probably move the pickup to the bottom just so the fuel line didn't have to do the loopy doo around the cylinder. This is something that I would probably do and not something that has to be done. This would also make the fuel line length possibly if not most definitely shorter which would help in fuel draw. Always remember it's best to keep your fuel as short as possible. You would just have to make sure on a landing though that it's not hanging down enough to get snagged and broken off. This is more likely to happen with the overflow pipe. That pipe can be trimmed off so that it just comes out of the sheeting. Anything too long will result in getting snapped off on a landing. Ken
Ken Cook- Top Poster
- Posts : 5408
Join date : 2012-03-27
Location : pennsylvania
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
The more I read your responses the more confused I become.Its that simple!! Change this, solder that..I dont want to do anything like that!!! Can you please just recommend a Tank for me?? Will the #9 tank work? I dont understand why that pickup is at the top of that tank and REALLY dont understand how fuel can work from the top down in a un-pressurized tank!!
Again this #9 tank is the recommended tank in the plans..THINK OF WHAT IM ASKING HERE!! If i position this tank with that pick-up on the bottom....the pick-up will be pointing toward the trailing edge...does that matter?? Im just about to give this up!! Pick ups on the top, bottom, cant flip it, solder it, plug it, brass fittings, corrosion...Holy S%4#!!
Again this #9 tank is the recommended tank in the plans..THINK OF WHAT IM ASKING HERE!! If i position this tank with that pick-up on the bottom....the pick-up will be pointing toward the trailing edge...does that matter?? Im just about to give this up!! Pick ups on the top, bottom, cant flip it, solder it, plug it, brass fittings, corrosion...Holy S%4#!!
ZACATTACK- Gold Member
- Posts : 328
Join date : 2012-04-15
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
You keep thinking that the fuel is trying to go up hill so to speak or down hill. Where that pipe goes inside the TANK is the same height as your nipple of the needle valve. In that particular plane it will be very close. When you place your finger over the venturi to pull a choke into the engine the fuel doesn't know that it's going uphill so to speak. This is due to the pickup of the tank being the same height as the needle valve. This is why I was suggesting to open the back of the tank up and look inside to see where it is. Perfect didn't make a habit of soldering the pickup tubes inside their tanks. Give me the dimensions of your tank now. I will check to see if I have one of that same size as I have bizzillion tanks laying around here. If I do, I will clean it and get it ready for you free of charge. How far away are you on this build to where you need the tank? Is there a way we can e-mail privately? I also have another question to ask you. Ken
Ken Cook- Top Poster
- Posts : 5408
Join date : 2012-03-27
Location : pennsylvania
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
In no way am I trying to confuse you. The reason I'm stating to check this and solder that is because once that tank is in the plane, It's in the plane. The only way your getting it out is to cut it out. Yes that tank will work. It will work as is. I just make it a point to open all commercially made tanks. I very rarely buy a commercially made tank due to problems I've encountered with them over the years. I'm not out to insult anyone's intelligence. When trying to explain these kind of things over the internet, it can be very confusing and also misunderstood. I just looked downstairs to see what I had. I do have some Perfect tanks but they may be smaller that the #9 you have. I must've thrown some of these out as they would literally fall out of the cabinet as I was opening the door. I know I had 2 #9's. Ken
Ken Cook- Top Poster
- Posts : 5408
Join date : 2012-03-27
Location : pennsylvania
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
E-Mail me I just sent it to you!!!!!
ZACATTACK- Gold Member
- Posts : 328
Join date : 2012-04-15
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
Zac, that tube coming out of the top of the #9 tank runs inside, all the way to the rear corner of the wedge where the fuel will mostly be pinned during flight. It's the tank you need. The other perfect tanks that have the tube coming out the front corner also extend all the way back into the rear corner of the wedge.
_________________
Don't Panic!
...and never Ever think about how good you are at something...
while you're doing it!
My Hot Rock & Blues Playlist
...and never Ever think about how good you are at something...
while you're doing it!
My Hot Rock & Blues Playlist
RknRusty- Rest In Peace
- Posts : 10869
Join date : 2011-08-10
Age : 67
Location : South Carolina, USA
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
Here, I drew you a picture of where the lines go inside the #9 tank.
_________________
Don't Panic!
...and never Ever think about how good you are at something...
while you're doing it!
My Hot Rock & Blues Playlist
...and never Ever think about how good you are at something...
while you're doing it!
My Hot Rock & Blues Playlist
RknRusty- Rest In Peace
- Posts : 10869
Join date : 2011-08-10
Age : 67
Location : South Carolina, USA
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
Looks simple enough. I am doing a Jr. Probably this week!
I guess I can just use any 2oz perfect or veco wedge and just solder in the holes and drill a new one for the pickup.
Thanks for the pic Rusty!
I guess I can just use any 2oz perfect or veco wedge and just solder in the holes and drill a new one for the pickup.
Thanks for the pic Rusty!
Cribbs74- Moderator
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Posts : 11892
Join date : 2011-10-24
Age : 50
Location : Tuttle, OK
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
Hopefully I got the pictures in order as I took them. All tanks are Perfect brand and these have never been used just sitting in boxes. In picture #1 the pickup is not into the corner and is on the floor of the tank. This tank will work but may hesitate in maneuvers(especially inversion) as the fuel level lowers. It could also cause the engine to keep surging at the end of the flight. Pickup needs to be raised up and pushed into the corner and soldered. The second pic shows the pickup exiting the top. Many of these designs came out the front of the tank. Either way the IMPORTANT part is the location within the tank and not where it exits. The next pic is a larger wedge with the pickup in the correct location except it could be about 1/8 longer to the back of the tank . This tank will work correctly although some fuel may be left in the tank towards the end of the run. Engine should cut off clean though. The last pic is the tiny wedge design this tank probably resembles the #9 tank the best. The pickup is in the proper location except that once again it should be soldered to the side. Problem with this tank is the corrosion around the pickup. Until this is completely rid of that it will cause nothing but problems with the run. Solution, is to get a toothbrush and initially use laquer thinner to clean it all out. This corrosion can cause the plating to come off and cause small particles to go through your engine and block spraybar assemblies. In the other examples, what appears to be corrosion is oil that was within the tank when new. This will flush out once the fuel is in tank. I hope this gives some insight as to why I always check the tanks. Here are 3 random tanks I picked out of the boxes and just opened up. I make it a practice to do this as it tells me what is really going on inside. Remember corrosion is the enemy to these great little engines. On a side note, my preference is to replace the brass tubes with copper. Even though my pictures make the pickup pipes appear to look like copper that is the factory oil that has congealed on them giving you that appearance. Ken
Ken Cook- Top Poster
- Posts : 5408
Join date : 2012-03-27
Location : pennsylvania
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
Shawn,
Would you happen to have a 2 oz wedge? I need one for my Jr. Satan as well. It need not be plumbed correctly or cleaned. I can do that on my own.
Thanks,
Ron
Would you happen to have a 2 oz wedge? I need one for my Jr. Satan as well. It need not be plumbed correctly or cleaned. I can do that on my own.
Thanks,
Ron
Cribbs74- Moderator
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Posts : 11892
Join date : 2011-10-24
Age : 50
Location : Tuttle, OK
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
Zac(?)
I’ve been watching this thread and it seems that you may have been overwhelmed by too many details without a description of the basics.
One: For the typical wedge tank under discussion, the end of the internal pick-up tube MUST be at the outside rear corner of the tank.
Reason: Due to centrifugal force the fuel will be forced to the outside of the circle and due to the wedge that is where the last drop should be either flying upright or inverted. As far as operation it doesn’t really matter how or where the pick-up tube exits the tank, or whether the fuel line goes thru, over or under the leading edge. Those details are based on other considerations.
Two: The end of the internal pick-up tube MUST be at the same level (height) as the engine needle/spray bar.
Reason: Otherwise gravity/head will not be equal in both upright and inverted flight. These criteria along with the goal of placing the tank as close to the engine as possible pretty much defines the location of the tank.
HTH
Al
I’ve been watching this thread and it seems that you may have been overwhelmed by too many details without a description of the basics.
One: For the typical wedge tank under discussion, the end of the internal pick-up tube MUST be at the outside rear corner of the tank.
Reason: Due to centrifugal force the fuel will be forced to the outside of the circle and due to the wedge that is where the last drop should be either flying upright or inverted. As far as operation it doesn’t really matter how or where the pick-up tube exits the tank, or whether the fuel line goes thru, over or under the leading edge. Those details are based on other considerations.
Two: The end of the internal pick-up tube MUST be at the same level (height) as the engine needle/spray bar.
Reason: Otherwise gravity/head will not be equal in both upright and inverted flight. These criteria along with the goal of placing the tank as close to the engine as possible pretty much defines the location of the tank.
HTH
Al
Big Al- Gold Member
- Posts : 116
Join date : 2011-08-17
Age : 90
Location : Louisiana
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
Big Al wrote:Zac(?)
I’ve been watching this thread and it seems that you may have been overwhelmed by too many details without a description of the basics....
Yes, we finally pinned it down to those basics via PM, and I went away wishing it had been posted in public. Thanks for the reinforcement, Big Al.ZACATTACK wrote:O GOT IT!!!!
_________________
Don't Panic!
...and never Ever think about how good you are at something...
while you're doing it!
My Hot Rock & Blues Playlist
...and never Ever think about how good you are at something...
while you're doing it!
My Hot Rock & Blues Playlist
RknRusty- Rest In Peace
- Posts : 10869
Join date : 2011-08-10
Age : 67
Location : South Carolina, USA
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
Hi Al, I would also like to thank you as well. I had the pleasure to speak with Lew. Looking forward to hearing the flight results. Ken
Ken Cook- Top Poster
- Posts : 5408
Join date : 2012-03-27
Location : pennsylvania
Re: Perfect #9 Tank
Great thanks to the boys in the thread!!! Ken...your awesome buddy!!! Rusty....great stuff as usual....For you guys to take time out of your busy lives to post pictures just shows the addictive qualities you posses..I love it and it's a pleasure to be a part of this Forum...You guys are great...Big thanks!! You guys finally rammed it through my thick head BUT I just found a G15 Super Tigre in mint condition and I'm debating to go with a Uniflow setup now!!!
ZACATTACK- Gold Member
- Posts : 328
Join date : 2012-04-15
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