Sanye AP 09 RC

Thanks GG,

I think this plane is so ugly, it's got to be a unique build. I'm going to keep looking for a suitable twin. I'm leaning toward something civilian for those engines. All of my builds have been WWII birds in camo. They are hard to see against the trees sometimes.

944_Jim wrote:Thanks GG, I think this plane is so ugly, it's got to be a unique build. I'm going to keep looking for a suitable twin. I'm leaning toward something civilian for those engines. All of my builds have been WWII birds in camo. They are hard to see against the trees sometimes.

Some think that ugly is the new beautiful.

There are two other twins that might be worthy of consideration. One is Outerzone: Focke-Wulf Ta 154 Moskito





The other by same author is Outerzone: Henschel Hs 129





I know these are warbirds, but they have a really nice and different appearance to you usual run of the mill ones.

Regarding visibility, if you use the Romel desert scheme might make them more visible than forest colors.

Here are some to look at LOL .. https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=twin+engine+model+airplanes&FORM=HDRSC2

Seller welched after taking the $$. I'm afraid no AP twin in my future. Thanks anyway for the help with suggestions.

944_Jim wrote:Seller welched after taking the $$. I'm afraid no AP twin in my future. Thanks anyway for the help with suggestions.

There is an RC one on E-Bay, Buy It Now, E-Bay: AP Hornet 09 New R/C Plane Engine, $34.88 + $7.88 Shipping. Seller has 1,390 transactions with 100% approval:

1/2A Nut wrote:You can use a Saito .72 muffler on it the threads fit. Look at the still pic in the vid before hitting play as I have it covered up when running to keep the goo on the towel.



Published on Dec 9, 2015; AP .09 Hornet, MA 5.5x4.5 19,300 / .92lbs /14.72oz thrust / 82mph /.20hp / 149w est. unloaded 21.3k / 91mph

Brad, I took your suggestion and landed myself a Saito muffler and 10 mm header pipe, fits just like you said it would.


This one has the curved header pipe, but I think that will be more practical when engine is mounted on an aircraft, angled away from the engine firewall. With the lock nut, it can be adjusted to any angle needed.

Yes I have seen a profile fun fly plane use the curved extension / side mounted engine, looked perfect for the application.
Also pull the aluminum muffler off and look into the exhaust hole you will see a secondary sound baffle, I drilled a hole
through it to improve breathing aka rpm. The hole was almost as big as the ID of the exhaust tip. Will make a sweet
sound when you run it up try it as is tach it then if you wish drill it out and see the increase in rpm. I would like to
get a turbo head for the engine.

Several years passed and I could not leave enough alone. As of today, just gained another, now in shipment. This time, it is a C/L or F/F version with venturi and standard cake pan muffler, won with $40 bid, plus ship and tax.





Should be here in several days.

Mr. George,
Where did you find this one? I saw one on FB, but the guy wanted $75. That's too much for an engine I tried to shake off. Yet, I still keep an eye out. I don't know why...yes I do. I'm a hoarder. Plain and simple.

Congrats on a rare find!

Thanks, Jim.

944_Jim wrote:Where did you find this one?

On E-Bay, it popped up during a search, put in lowest bid, snagged it.

I always pick up the .09 and .15s at swap meets whenever they are a deal.  I have seen them for $75 quite often. They were $35 new when still being made.  Because of this I started playing with them because if I removed too much material, the new motor would still be cheap.  Better than ruining a Rossi or Fora.  Bought the M 10 die to make headers and made turbo heads.  Think I have 3 of each size now.  I prefer the blue head .15 over the AP, but the .09 is great if you need an .09.  My examples run faster than the TD .09, and similar to the OS .10s.  All things being equal like no muffler and 10% fuel.  Got a .15 on an F2D combat that can not seem to get a setting right now using the bladder.  Was told to use a smaller prop, but I know the rod does not like 24,000 rpm. The .15 has a bushing, the .09 does not.  I had one working well with a plastic tank on a coroplast combat plane.  They were my answer to the Cox  in the next century till Sanye collapsed.  Got some pics here probably the venturi, bigger 6mm exhaust outlet for F2D, even made a needle valve. You can see the .09 head is smaller than the .15, with no fins.

After running the AP .061 / .09  I had to try the .15
Did a bench test using a prop that would mimic anticipated unloaded rpm for speed.
This also helps to understand how much power to the prop is possible when on the pipe.
I went with removing the black anodized surface to improve cooling.



AP Yellow Jacket .15 / Profi 2.5cc Tuned Pipe
APC 6x3 (to stage on the pipe) noted best peak 25,516 rpm / 73 mph pitch speed
Thrust 40oz - 2.5lb / .465hp - 347w no NV tweak new engine / load to imitate in flight rpm
70F / 25% nitro 20% castor / MRP 9.75" - 160°
Example prop to fly with speed 5.7x7N to 23.5k / 156 mph potential prop pitch speed.
Engine responds to the Profi 2.5cc pipe like the AP 09 did with a 1.5cc pipe
Stock spinner nut was too bulky so grinded down to a lower weight bullet shape.

 

Brad, I noticed you were able to get the AP .15 (really a .135) up to 25,000 RPM. That is really cranking. At that rate I guess it would have the life expectancy of a racing engine. Haven't pulled the back of my .09 yet, but using a non-bushed crankshaft ends, would understand why that Cox fuel rules (20% with at least half Castor oil) would be the norm.

It is just too bad that these at one time cost effective engines are no longer produced. I've been wanting to acquire a .15, but now, they are commanding ridiculous high end prices over $100, seems now collectors want them. And this is all for an engine that was going for around $35 ten years ago.

The blue head ASP/Magnum is a better motor if you find one, but if you want a rear exhaust ABC BB motor, that gives slightly less power than the LA .15 then I guess they are good. Here a new LA .15 is $199 CDN. I have peeled a liner on one. I got 14,500 rpm on a 6 1/4 - 4 F2D combat prop with the AP. Really pretty good for a .135 cu in motor @ that price. Not sure if I used the turbo plug head for that run. I think the .09 is really what the motor is designed for. I found the muffler too restrictive and the piston too heavy on the .15 to rev where it wanted to be. It really is an oversize piston. Maybe lightening would be good.

Regarding the .15's, I gathered at the time the Sanye AP .15 was to be considered a budget sport engine with roughly the performance of the OS and Enya cross scavenged engines of the mid 1960's.

Even the muffler was not to enhance performance but emphasized economy in construction, engine based on (I am guessing) Sanye's past engines.

I need to get back on the trail again. I brought the Saito 4 stroke muffler and pipe, was for the Hobby Shack Real Thing, it should be less constrictive than the cake pan muffler.

Too many things to do.

GallopingGhostler wrote:Regarding the .15's, I gathered at the time the Sanye AP .15 was to be considered a budget sport engine with roughly the performance of the OS and Enya cross scavenged engines of the mid 1960's.

Even the muffler was not to enhance performance but emphasized economy in construction, engine based on (I am guessing) Sanye's past engines.

I need to get back on the trail again. I brought the Saito 4 stroke muffler and pipe, was for the Hobby Shack Real Thing, it should be less constrictive than the cake pan muffler.

Too many things to do.

Just unscrew the muffler outlet nipple and drill it out to 6mm and it will run better. It is only 4mm, 5mm with the tap drill size hole. The .09 does not lose as much power as the .15 from the restriction. I drilled the inlet to the muffler a bit larger too. Measure carefully so it is not too weak if you do that.

Engine came in yesterday, now is in my grubby little hands. Appears to be run up but very low use if any. It is indeed the factory venturi version (box labeled as such on the other side). The prop nut arrangement appears to be for a spinner system. It is too wide for standard prop hubs, was probably for a larger engine. I should be able to find a metric nut and appropriate washer to fit from the local hardware store, Monday.

According to Sceptre Flight archives, engine is 4.5 oz. with muffler. The Cox .15 Sportsman w/o muffling is 3.9 oz. By the time a muffler is installed, they are probably about the same weight. Judging also by the data on similar BB version Olympic, by down scoping a little to the Sportsman, appear to be roughly equivalent in power. Given the Sanye AP has a stroke of 0.47 in. and the Cox Sportsman 0.556 in., the Cox in my estimation will be the stronger performing engine especially with the type planes I prefer, with greater thrust by swinging larger diameter props at equivalent RPM's.

Look...twins! Both NIB. Dunno what to hang them in, but it won't be a priority. Now I can walk away from this hunt.

944_Jim wrote:Look...twins! Both NIB. Dunno what to hang them in, but it won't be a priority. Now I can walk away from this hunt.

Good afternoon, Jim. Are you saying you have these, or, they were offered for sale but you did not buy or one reason or another?

Being Schneurle with a touch more power, I imagine that they could be put in a C/L twin for two stronger legacy cross scavenge .15's or weaker .19's.

Well, George, I started with one. Then I almost had another. But I came to my senses and stopped looking.

Then you popped up a few weeks ago with your recent one. And this one popped up on FB and I made an offer I thought he'd refuse.

Now I have two!

Nice little critters. I wish I had one.

The design of the muffler looks a bit restrictive though: a narrow drum with sharp deflection of gas flow direction..I wonder how the muffled and unmuffled speeds compare?

I could not find info on Sceptreflight.

balogh wrote:Nice little critters. I wish I had one. The design of the muffler looks a bit restrictive though: a narrow drum with sharp deflection of gas flow direction..I wonder how the muffled and unmuffled speeds compare? I could not find info on Sceptreflight.

https://www.coxengineforum.com/t12078-sanye-ap-09-rc#154097
Brad in Texas @1/2A Nut got 19,300 RPM on a Masters 5.5x4.5 prop and less restrictive Saito 10mm 4 stroke muffler.

Sanye factory made the engines, but they were marketed under the AP label:
http://sceptreflight.com/Model%20Engine%20Tests/AP%20Hornet%2009.html AP Hornet 09 Review, Aug. 1999 MAN

Performance with muffler on 10% nitro fuel:


So, it has potential to perform better with a less restrictive muffler, why I followed Brad's advice.

Thank you, George, indeed, these escaped my attention..