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Happy Half A Scorpion More than a Trainer

Post  Yabby Sun Feb 05, 2023 4:23 am

I built a Half A Scorpion as per the OZ plans https://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=5973 some time ago for my lad to fly and I ended up having a fly of it myself and really enjoyed flying it. I thought if might be able to do more than it does as per the current plans and made some minor changes that for once resulted in a fantastic plane to fly. I flew the modified Scorpion today on 42 ft .008 steel and its the best fun ive had flying since coming back to CL. The thing was a genuine blast to fly and yet so calm in its behaviour ( mostly Laughing ). Some photos below and then the mods I made to it and how it flew.

Half A Scorpion More than a Trainer Scorp010
On the build - Prep table at home

Half A Scorpion More than a Trainer Scorp110
On the launch table at the field. Single drop off wheel, rear stooge, on a card table.

I changed the nose of the fuse and shortened it by 50 mm as I mount my engines differently to the plan. Doing this places my prop in the same position as the plan. The main change was the elevator. I kept the exact same shape and angles of the elevator tips but changed the centre chord of the elevator to be 40mm instead of 25 mm and the chord at the elevator tips to be 30 mm instead of 20 mm. I also added a bent piece of music wire that sticks up like an antennae just infront of the fin to stop the fin getting broken when the plane flips over on landing. Like a little roll cage in a car. Thumbs Up  I used an 049 TD with a slitted cylinder running at about 7 to 8 tenths throttle/needle. The plane was quite fast and surprisingly responsive. I was able to fly Wingovers, inside loops, outside loop ( cos I was in a lot of trouble  Laughing ), horizontal eights and inverted. I couldnt believe how well it flew inverted, stable as....... . flew several laps stable inverted which for me is surprising. the plane looped effortlessly and could actually be steered through the loops and you could square off a corner really easy and tighten and open the loop easily as suited whilst in the loop. I was really surprised by how easy it was to fly this plane through those manauveres on 42 foot lines with a TD.  

It would definately fly 52 foot lines on a good day with a TD 049 running flat out with a TD cylinder and Kamtecknik head. For anyone learning to fly loops, wingovers,.... the things I mentioned earlier this is a great and very stable plane to do them with. And super easy and cheap to build, and launches from a card table if need be. I was amazed at how straight and stable it flew wingovers!!! Im building myself another one. It may be a 'Trainer' but its a very good trainer that does much much more than roundy roundy and is a simple slab profile with shaped airfoyle wing.

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Happy Re: Half A Scorpion More than a Trainer

Post  Ken Cook Sun Feb 05, 2023 10:02 am

Gary, a piece of advice. I see your plane sitting there in the picture with your tank angled incorrectly. You want the tank as close to the fuselage on a profile as possible. Therefore, you want the front of the tank in your situation hitting the profile hard and the rear of the tank angled outboard a few degrees. I see the length of your fuel tubing and the placement of your tank, it's a wonder the TD even worked. If this was mine, it would've never worked. If you could move the tank forward as much as possible even if it means cutting out the cheek blocks.

Get the tank as close to the engine as possible and shorten that line. In addition, moving the engine a tad outboard would also help. For instance, if you are one that uses engine offset, this would benefit here because it kicks the venturi outboard and more inline with your fuel pickup. The more you can align your fuel pickup with your venturi, the better your engine will perform. When I see this, it tells me that your engine is struggling due to centrifugal force.
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Happy Re: Half A Scorpion More than a Trainer

Post  Yabby Sun Feb 05, 2023 2:15 pm

Ken Cook wrote:                  Gary, a piece of advice. I see your plane sitting there in the picture with your tank angled incorrectly. You want the tank as close to the fuselage on a profile as possible. Therefore, you want the front of the tank in your situation hitting the profile hard and the rear of the tank angled outboard a few degrees. I see the length of your fuel tubing and the placement of your tank, it's a wonder the TD even worked. If this was mine, it would've never worked. If you could move the tank forward as much as possible even if it means cutting out the cheek blocks.

          Get the tank as close to the engine as possible and shorten that line. In addition, moving the engine a tad outboard would also help. For instance, if you are one that uses engine offset, this would benefit here because it kicks the venturi outboard and more inline with your fuel pickup.  The more you can  align your fuel pickup with your venturi, the better your engine will perform. When I see this, it tells me that your engine is struggling due to centrifugal force.

Hey Ken @Ken Cook , thanks for taking the time to comment. I hear what you are saying and will make the changes you suggest. I have several TDs that wont run on the setup like that and two that do no problems. The two that do are brand new just run in and have great suction still, but that will change. I will pay more attention to tank placement and resolve it correctly. The plane is great to fly so best other details be correct for best running and starrting.

When you say moving the engine a tad outboard, do you mean actually moving its mounting point outboard / offcentre to the outboard side or just adding more engine offset. The engine is allready offset a bit. I try not to offset the engine angle too much and rely on speed for the force to keep lines tight mostly. but it is offset a bit. I can certainly offset the engine more very easily and I can also move it physically off centre easily if that is what you meant.

I just went and looked at the plane and I can now clearly see what you mean as to the tank position. I could reduce the fuel tube length by about 2/3ds by moving the tank. In some other similar planes with TDs I have starrting problems with the tail down and the long fuel line would make that much worse

Thanks again. Thumbs Up Very Happy

GaryB
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Happy Re: Half A Scorpion More than a Trainer

Post  Ken Cook Sun Feb 05, 2023 6:35 pm

A big problem with profiles is fuel delivery due to the width of the tank and the fact that the tank is outboard of the engine. A TD is just about at it's maximum velocity when it comes to fuel draw. You saying that some of your engines won't work on this setup could be directly related to venturi sizing. I would almost bet that not all stock venturi's are the same size not too mention used engines that were purchased that someone drilled out. The max size that one could go to on the TD .049 is 5/32". Any larger and you break into the peripheral jet holes. Even a screened venturi offers a slight advantage over a unscreened version given that they're both the same size due to it's ability to draw fuel. What I do when I have one that's not effectively drawing fuel is to take the center bushing of a Sig 1/2A bellcrank and place it into the venturi upside down. I then encapsulate the entire venturi with a piece of surgical bladder tubing. This chokes down the venturi for added fuel draw. Most of my venturi's are drilled out to the max because I rarely use a tank anymore with TD's.

As for my comment about moving the engine, I meant do both. Move it closer outboard and offer some outboard thrust. In doing both, you effectively move the venturi closer to the pickup of the tank. This will improve fuel draw and it will also shorten your fuel line. Moving the tank forward will also obviously shorten the tubing. This can be beneficial to your engine runs.

If your current setup is working, disregard my comments. I was just making a observation and some solution. I guess if it's not broke, don't fix it.
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Post  rsv1cox Sun Feb 05, 2023 7:02 pm

Yabby, I look carefully at all your designs and I must say they all go against convention and must drive Ken and a few others crazy.  The gap between elevator and horizontal stab., the off set bell crank, the position of your leadout guide, your fuel tanks position, your type of engine mount.  

But, dog-gone it it makes you happy and works for you.  You build a plane fast in order to fly it and have fun.  I envy you and wish I had your enthusiusm and ability.  I truly do wish I lived next door.

Bob

 I truly do wish I lived next door.

Well I said that mostly because of the crabs. Smile
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Happy Re: Half A Scorpion More than a Trainer

Post  Yabby Sun Feb 05, 2023 7:18 pm

Thaks Ken, I will move the tank for sure. All of my engines are bought new from Cox International and ExModelEngines, some as engines some as new parts (crankcase assemblies, NVA assemblies, Venturis, Cylinders etc.) that I have assembled into engines and run in, and then used quite well. I dont overly like second hand parts as the pedigree (over the net) cant be guaranteed (I do trust Cox International and ExmodelEngines on second hand though) . I dont need the extra agravation of say a venturi being wrong sized as you have explained people can do. I leave everything stock other than modding the CK back plate / Kamtechknik radial mount, and often I run a standard glow as it performs very well with the standard glow also and Im not racing or competing.

Comments gladly received! cheers I listen and try to learn, the one thing I know for certain is I dont really know much about CL and I am thankful of any advice that I can put through the mixer and try to end up with a better plane/engine/setup. Beer Cheers sunny

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Post  rsv1cox Sun Feb 05, 2023 7:34 pm

Thanks Yabby, no disrespect intended by my remarks. Quite the contrary.
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Post  Yabby Mon Feb 06, 2023 4:25 pm

rsv1cox wrote:Thanks Yabby, no disrespect intended by my remarks.  Quite the contrary.  

Hey Bob, that was never in doubt!! Beer Cheers Beer Cheers
Sometimes I just chew the fat on the lifelong "Gary has all the ability............" comments. lol! Nobody does mean them disrespectfully. They are genuinely always made and intended as positive Thumbs Up

Its a Gary hangup thing of reflection at 62 (from my first school report onwards) when another person notices and says wow youve got so much ability, :-) Unfortunately they have proven true. All the ability in the world but......................

I just try to have fun with what Ive been given. this forum is the only source of advice I have about CL so I definately listen and try to do as suggested. But it is one of the things Im not overyly good at, build or flying, but I try to learn from the advice offered on the forum. I wouldnt be flying CL and enjoying it were it not for this forum. I Love This Forum! I may not be great at building and flying, but I really enjoy it. Very Happy Very Happy
cheers Airplane sunny

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Post  Ken Cook Mon Feb 06, 2023 4:35 pm

Good attitude, it goes a long way in enjoying the hobby.
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