Open COX speed event with prizes out to 3rd place in 2 categories

fredvon4 Sat Sep 08, 2018 12:29 pm

Dead line mid night USA CDST 31 Dec 2018...Can be extended to mid night CDST 31 January by popular request of CEF members actually participating

This is a "run what ya brung" event
Two rules only:
Any stock or modified Cox engine, any fuel, any propeller
Under .049 on 32" lines timed for 10 laps (yes Virginia...this means .010 and .020 engines)
.049 and up ( yes Virginia a conquest .15 is OK) on 42" lines timed for 10 laps

CEF and the forum is the Contest director, arbiter, and management of this of this NON AMA event....all claims of 10 lap speed must be evidenced by a video of the flight posted to CEF....all claims and videos submitted become property of CEF for all promotional and advertising rights...winners should expect to be interviewed and their story and exploits entered into the public domain

Fred C von Gortler IV LLC/ INC/ .COM/ .ORG/ .GOV/ . EDU is the sponsor

Is offering cash prizes only to 3 place in 2 categories: under .049 COX engine---.049 and above COX engine
1st place $100
2nd place $50
3rd place $25

Odds of winning any prize is established by total entries that comply with all past CEF contest rules and factorial of the 99/78th rule of profound error as currently disclaimed by almost all fantasy league betting programs

For some brief history:
https://www.coxengineforum.com/t11255-cox-engine-forum-speed-contest-2018

additional history on the sponsor: from Oct 2017

Mostly cuz I like these CEF unique events---- and I am a big proponent of max participation... see my thoughts on the Engine of the month where I lament the lack of participation in spite of generous prizes donated

AH, Poo... All my TeeDee's only have Galbraith heads and Nelson Plugs and none will run on suction
Just bought a real cool Cox magnesium speed pan

Went back and re-read the entire CEF Reed Speed rules and remembered why I did not enter...

I really like the basic concept JPvelo is campaigning... but would like to see it even less restrictive... Open.... run what ya brung---everything goes event

I still believe in Basic ---....just so we have a basis to compare and agree

Keep it same limits on exact line length...

MUST BE COX base engine (any mods) but the CEF speed contest is all about COX engine...any configuration and size...

The prop rule is not really needed... there are combat and speed glass props.... most all commercially available

NOT much in the way of real exotic high zoot props out there...Cox engines all have a limit on RPM

I am OK with #35% N and no exotic fuels... 'tis what most of us have and run anyway

OTOH--- I have played with 40~60%N and additives... grin
Would not mind reading and seeing an "in rule" attempt and then, an "exception to fuel" run by some member...documented

Say ---- for example---I ran a open design model, on 32' lines and Teedee UNLIMITED Cox engine with Sig Champion 35%N to 63 MPH... solidly in third place against other CEF contestants

BUT ---then I documented a second attempt using exotic 60% brew that manged only 10 laps before the cylinder blew off...BUT the math sez I was spinning 99MPH....OK I am not a top dog winner... BUT it is still cool, funny and sort of demands next year some one attempt to BEAT 99MPH

So with that in mind...

.010 class
.020 class
. 049/.051 class
yadda Yadda

We all know the members on CEF are fine gents and ladies....gentleman/gentlewomen rules.. we trust your claims and desire video to have fun watching your attempt

There are no prizes of any real value...but do intend to catalog/acknowledge your winning for all time within the tomes of the perpetual CEF inter-web forum in words and photos

I also would ask the deadline be extended to mid spring 2018...say April 30...many of the members need at least a 6 month window to find acceptable trials and WX for record attempt

Please dear group....no matter the rules... support this event,

I am officially NOW a sponsor with:
1-- $100 US(or foreign country equivalent) Cash prize to First place (evidenced by CEF popular vote)
1-- Brodak or RSM kit of choice from the 1/2 a list of kits for Second place (evidenced by CEF popular vote)((basically allocated $75)
1-- Sig MFG or Tower single quart fuel cost for any blend desired for Third place (evidenced by CEF popular vote)(( basically allocated $30))

I eliminate myself from any prizes

I nominate Rusty/Kim/Ron Cribbs to be arbitrators of any and all disputes

JPvelo ...since this has been his passion over the years, is free to accept or REJECT any or all of my notions without hurting my fragile feeling in any way...

Ken Cook Sat Sep 08, 2018 2:11 pm

Fred, excuse me for what may sound like a question already answered. I'm not understanding your line length suggestions. If I'm reading this correctly, your saying that ALL .049's and up are 42'? Everything under is 35'? That's quite a disadvantage to the reedies. However if that's what it is, it is. Does the timing start at takeoff, or after X amount of laps?

modelbuilder49 Sat Sep 08, 2018 5:57 pm

Howdy Fred! Well, all I can say is .... "I'm in" Laughing

I have no idea what I'm going to use, how I'm going to do it, or when I'm going to "'git'er done" but it sound like it's gonn'a be fun. I don't know the first thing about fiberglass or kevlar molding, engine or prop mods and really don't give a hoot but as far as I'm concerned you call the rules and say balsa is legal then I'll comply .... to the best of my ability Laughing

.

1. I would ask you to reconsider line lengths though so I can have fun and enter my little .020 Rivets .... if it will even have enough fuel to fly 10 laps Smile

.
2. Oh yeah, Huh...

I have to follow Ken on this one: Does the timing start at takeoff, or after X amount of laps Huh...

? (For some reason all of mine seem to take off like somebody stuck a banana in the exhaust stacks but after a few laps they seem to kick in pretty good Laughing

)
3. Is there a limit to the number of times a fellow enters? In other words, as I write this, I've got about 20 different models all with their own Cox 1/2A's (.020, .049's, and .051's) mounted and while not a dadgum one of them is a "whoopteedo super hot racer", they're mine, they're ordinary, they're average and they're fun to play and mess with. S'pose I entered each one of them Huh...

, would that be okay??

fredvon4 Sun Sep 09, 2018 12:58 pm

Please guys do NOT try to make this very hard...I do not care one Witt if a Cox teedee .010 is flown on 10 foot line length at 1.7 second laps

Every thing I wrote above suggest max sarcasim, max fun, some meager attempt at our typical COX CEF forum sense of self regulation and fairness

I truly doubt any true Forum member will try to pass off a 22.6" line length run to try and win a paltry $100

Simple rules....COX engines only

OK you guys tell me a fair Line length and engine size division...I really do not care=== I just want to have fun, promote this great web site, and entice max participation with a CASH prize

Hell I think we all get a great laugh out of some simple shingle 7 oz plank plane with a TeeDee .051 on bladder spinning the ID10T pilot into the ground on 15' lines....Remember Video required....

Cheating is discouraged but readily assumed.... grin.....In fact I am considering a consolidated cheaters category for MOST inventive or original CHEAT....mishaps a stupid funny video of some nut case screaming Cox engine on 60% Vitamin N and 10 foot lines

Serious guys I just want max participation and fun videos and have disposable CASH to promote the idea...add to the discussion...what do YOU want as RULES... I personally say None are needed...CEF has a LOT of FUNNY GUYS already

modelbuilder49 Sun Sep 09, 2018 1:33 pm

fredvon4 wrote:Please guys do NOT try to make this very hard...I do not care one Witt if a Cox teedee .010 is flown on 10 foot line length at 1.7 second laps. Every thing I wrote above suggest max sarcasim, max fun, some meager attempt at our typical COX CEF forum sense of self regulation and fairness. Serious guys I just want max participation and fun videos and have disposable CASH to promote the idea...add to the discussion...what do YOU want as RULES... I personally say None are needed...CEF has a LOT of FUNNY GUYS already

Okay! Gotcha!! Just have fun, make a video and be content! Cuzzin' .... I'm all 'fer it! Thankee, thankee, thankee!!!

modelbuilder49 Sat Dec 15, 2018 5:58 pm

Greetings Fellow Cox Speed Competitors! Well, here's my entry for the Open Speed Contest Sad

. I'm so embarrassed because I really had hoped to do better but at least I tried! Over the past few weeks it feels like nothing I did would get any of my Cox engines running properly .... nothing Huh...

! Finally, I had no choice because we'll be heading out of town for the holidays and this was the last chance for me to get an entry posted. It was so crazy because the warm-up engine runs were awesome but for the only flight recorded, the engine decided to "pig" out on me Sad

! Nevertheless, I was able to get the required number of laps (10) on 32' lines and was using 15% nitro (since that was all I had Smile

). If timed after the first full lap, the flight time is 1 minute 4.46 seconds or 21.27 mph. If timed after the first three full laps, the flight time is 1 minute 1.57 seconds or 22.27 mph.

https://youtu.be/MnZGd-wUJ_A

Open COX speed event with prizes out to 3rd place in 2 categories Img_6410

Merry Christmas Everyone Lighting The Tree

Jim Carter
Titusville, FL.

Ken Cook Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:39 pm

Jim, is that the prop you were using for this? That appears to me to be a 6" prop. When you mentioned pig out, I can only assume that the engine was lean on the ground and then went over lean in the air. I can tell you that a Black Widow is not going to be real happy on that prop and a 5" would suit the engine much better. While a 5x3 safety tip prop would be happier, I wouldn't use one for speed as that prop performs poorly compared to the square tip. Watching the video it certainly didn't want to wake up and the inconsistency was causing the model to pitch up and down. I'm assuming your fuel is good? Nonetheless, it looks pretty cool. Ken

Oldenginerod Sat Dec 15, 2018 11:24 pm

Ken Cook wrote:Jim, is that the prop you were using for this? That appears to me to be a 6" prop. When you mentioned pig out, I can only assume that the engine was lean on the ground and then went over lean in the air. I can tell you that a Black Widow is not going to be real happy on that prop and a 5" would suit the engine much better. While a 5x3 safety tip prop would be happier, I wouldn't use one for speed as that prop performs poorly compared to the square tip. Watching the video it certainly didn't want to wake up and the inconsistency was causing the model to pitch up and down. I'm assuming your fuel is good? Nonetheless, it looks pretty cool. Ken

The way the engine really picked up just before it quit I'd say it was rich and leaned off at the end. A 5X3 would certainly bring the revs up to a more stable run. Because of the light load on a 5X3 I'd say you'd have less variation between the on-ground speed and the in-flight speed of the engine, which would make it easier to tune.

**944_Jim** Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:31 am

I've got too much on my plate, but want to jump inot the deap end anyway...from a high diving board...with no dive experience!

Can we get an extension? I'm twiddling my thumbs until I hear otherwise. It'll be Cox...no AP or Norvel on my next bash-up. And bash-up it will be!

**Cribbs74** Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:55 am

I may try and get a flight in. I have that 1/2A shoestring with the worked over Space Hopper in it.

Since line length has gone down I should be able to fly it out back. Last time on 40’ lines I ran it into a tree and had a DNF. The plane has been repaired. It’s ugly now, but perfectly flyable.

Ron

rsv1cox Sun Dec 16, 2018 10:29 am

I love the whole concept Fred and I will be an attentive watcher. But us up the frozen north guys are at an disadvantage especially in the east. It's difficult to find dry ground around here anymore.

But it would be fun to enter this. No weight, no drag, no power. Smile

Open COX speed event with prizes out to 3rd place in 2 categories Fireba21

BTW - One hundred bucks paltry? That buys ten engines for me.

Bob

fredvon4 Sun Dec 16, 2018 11:47 am

I fear many members in the frozen tundra of Canada and Siberia and Finland and WV need some future warm air and dry ground for a speed attempt or two

So New dead line 31 May 2019

So sayeth the Sponsor
So sayeth the flock

Can we get a second on this motion?

**Cribbs74** Sun Dec 16, 2018 11:51 am

I’m good with it.

rsv1cox Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:09 pm

Cribbs74 wrote:I’m good with it.

X2

**944_Jim** Sun Dec 16, 2018 3:12 pm

Man, I just wanted enough time to throw something together. Now I have some planning time!

Thanks guys...I'm oafishly throwing my plane in the ring!
Officially,

modelbuilder49 Sun Dec 16, 2018 4:28 pm

Ken Cook wrote:Jim, is that the prop you were using for this? That appears to me to be a 6" prop. When you mentioned pig out, I can only assume that the engine was lean on the ground and then went over lean in the air. I can tell you that a Black Widow is not going to be real happy on that prop and a 5" would suit the engine much better. While a 5x3 safety tip prop would be happier, I wouldn't use one for speed as that prop performs poorly compared to the square tip. Watching the video it certainly didn't want to wake up and the inconsistency was causing the model to pitch up and down. I'm assuming your fuel is good? Nonetheless, it looks pretty cool. Ken

Hi Ken, yep that was the prop I used. I'd tried a different one earlier (a 5x3) but for whatever reason, I swapped it during what seemed like a purely freaky session, last Saturday. You see, out of 6 different engines on six different planes, we couldn't get not one of them to fire or start and yes, I had three other guys with me, all of whom had messed with these engines in the past, so the knowledge base was there Huh...

. All the plugs were good and strong yet not one engine would do anything and none of us could figure out why Huh...

. Yet during this session, this engine fired and ran like a banshee during the initial warmup run Surprised

. We were using the exact same fuel and the exact same start box and I didn't charge the battery!! (actually I forgot to charge it Shocked

!! Best of all, it used up a whole tank of fuel too! So, I decided to go for it as I was running out of time to "play". So, we fired it up, it sounded pretty good, I ran out, grabbed the handle and voila' Shocked

!! Oh well, it was fun.

Actually this poor performance lies directly at my feet because I knew I should have been practicing more frequently and should not have waited until the last minute. We're slated to head out to spent the holidays with family and I've known it for a couple of months now .... procrastination caught up with me Doh!

Hopefully I'll get to do it again .... someday Very Happy

!!

modelbuilder49 Sun Dec 16, 2018 4:40 pm

fredvon4 wrote:I fear many members in the frozen tundra of Canada and Siberia and Finland and WV need some future warm air and dry ground for a speed attempt or two

So New dead line 31 May 2019

So sayeth the Sponsor
So sayeth the flock

Can we get a second on this motion?

WHAT??

Here I struggled to meet the deadline which was set back in September .... (actually I piddled my way up to it Laughing

) and now you're changing it .... at the "last minute" .... Doh!

??

................... Okay, Okay, Okay, Kool, Cool

!! I'll second that motion!! Hopefully .... jus' maybe my pathetic attempt has been an inspiration to others enter the fun and the fray!! Laughing

Actually Fred, I think the rest of the guys are "skeeeeerrrd" cauz 'dey knows I'll be one speedy weenie!! Laughing

Jim "The Slow Poke" Carter
Titusville, FL

**944_Jim** Sun Dec 16, 2018 8:47 pm

I'd have been good with a week. Really! I hope no one is mad at me for asking.

Marleysky Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:00 pm

944_Jim wrote:I'd have been good with a week. Really! I hope no one is mad at me for asking.

Nope, I for one am glad you asked! I thought the contest ended in June, so I haven’t done a thing. Now, I’m going to get something ready for May 31st!

batjac Tue Dec 18, 2018 1:02 am

I usually don’t enter these speed contests anymore. I don’t have the temperament for spending long hours tweaking engines to get the peak performance. But this contest has me interested. So, after spending a few days exhaustively reviewing all the rules and requirements, and then consulting with an aerodynamicist, a Materials PhD, and that lawyer guy who speaks really soft and fast at the beginning of those used car commercials on the radio, I have come up with my design for this contest. I’m tied up with the holiday, but after Christmas, I’ll build my entry. I might even get to fly it at the New Year’s Day fly-In at Delta Park.

The Thorough Mark

Oldenginerod Tue Dec 18, 2018 3:23 am

I'm not sure about the 42 foot lines as that will require me to find somewhere else to fly, which is effectively illegal around these parts. 32' is about my limit at home. If I can get one of my "finished but unflown" planes in the air I'll just run with that. I'll need to measure my yard again, and make up some lines.

As long as southern hemisphere entries are allowed. The advantage I have I guess is that it's summer here. Hot

fredvon4 Tue Dec 18, 2018 12:06 pm

INTERNATIONAL EVENT Hot

roddie Wed Dec 19, 2018 5:40 pm

Oldenginerod wrote:I'm not sure about the 42 foot lines as that will require me to find somewhere else to fly, which is effectively illegal around these parts. 32' is about my limit at home. If I can get one of my "finished but unflown" planes in the air I'll just run with that. I'll need to measure my yard again, and make up some lines.

As long as southern hemisphere entries are allowed. The advantage I have I guess is that it's summer here.

Hey Rod,

Happy Holidays! I'd really like to see you enter an airplane. Last I knew, the rules were loose. When you state your line-length.. the rest can be calculated for scoring.

Shorter lines would translate into increased laps to cover the total-distance.

I'd take every inch of that 32' Smile

especially where it's at home. Nice to have room for a 1/2A sport-circle. Thumbs Up

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Re: Open COX speed event with prizes out to 3rd place in 2 categories

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Re: Open COX speed event with prizes out to 3rd place in 2 categories