Stunt contest practice for me and the Shoestring

Rusty,

Funny this should come up as I was balking about the 5 point deduction I would take if I flew the Super Clown in OTS.

The clown was kitted to have working flaps and even depicts so in the PDQ instructions. Anyway, The Ringmaster if it tickles your fancy is a quick build and could fly the OTS with ease. There are so many plans available and if you want a light kit one can be obtained from Pat King. Scratching one should be a cinch.

Ron

Contacting the guys at the club would certainly be in order. For a beginner they will more than likely turn their heads to it. ALL OF THE EVENTS need participation and pilots. TO suggest that you wouldn't be able to fly would be quite silly in my opinion. Even the die hard OTS flyers I know bend the rules as well. I don't fly OTS and never did or have any interest in doing so. I just don't exactly understand the OTS pattern so I can't comment on it. Having participated in running our club contest in the past, I can say we were very flexible. Ken

Ken, believe me, I'm under no illusion that OTS or any pattern is easy. I thought I was so cool snapping my Baby Streaks around, doing overhead loops, and lately V8s, but trying to do the most basic AMA stunts has quickly cut me down to size. Now at least I have something to shoot for, and I think the OTS is a better training pattern for my skill set. I need something to focus on to help me tame my scatterbrained approach to flying, and ultimately still have the fun I do it for.

Ron, I read your thread about the flap penalty, and that was actually what that inspired me to take another look; that and a post by Mark in my SS thread the other day. And after I found out about the October contest, I thought it was time to see if I can really do it.

I don't know if the Yak qualifies, but it might be ready in time, to fly, but not much practice time. Wayne, my new CL buddy is working the contest I mentioned above. This afternoon he told me about a 1/2A contest coming up too. So that gives me a reason to practice pattern flying with those. I'm going to slow the Streak down and start practicing with it too. The APC 6x2 might work. It's fast but manageable on 35' so 40' might work well. 45' might be too much. I'll ask one of the organizers if I can fly the SS. I'll even do it unofficially if they'll score me, or at least give me some advice.

Hopefully when October comes, I'll still have the SS.

Rusty

Brother YOU are a PRIME CANDIDATE to get off your ass and fly combat!!

Seriously, I never could get the timing down pat to fly the AMA pattern as it is easy to learn BUT very difficult to master...engine RPM, 2-4-2, flaps, prop, etc... and in my opinion the judges are just too critical about what a square corner is...

I think Ken and a few others would agree...do NOT attempt to compete the first time in 1/2a pattern... form your routine with a big easy plane like the ringmaster or clown

BUT seriously Rusty we all need to meet and have fun with COMBAT flying

This Aug I will meet Duke and a few others at the bladder Grabber, next year several of us should attend the Brodak fly and ideally many of us should descent on the Muncie IA NATS and put Cox Forums Dot Com on the MAP!

http://www.flyinglines.org/Action.html

Rusty, I wasn't suggesting the OTS pattern was easy, I meant just easier than the beginner AMA PAMPA pattern due to it already including most of the maneuvers your already familiar with. I never flew OTS like I mentioned and I certainly don't want to start as it just seems to complicated for me to learn currently.  I have judged beginner at our club contest. I certainly didn't look for or criticize anyone who couldn't do a maneuver. If their timing was correct and the maneuver was recognizeable it was judged on it's shape and smoothness. Flying the pattern is something that requires practice. Too many times we tend to overemphasize on how high or how low the maneuvers can be placed. As long as the beginner is aware of where they should be, that really is all that matters. Any judge would know that a beginner is going to fly high automatically. I've seen many advanced pilots fly too high as well and this happens when we fly over asphalt which we do frequently.

I did notice something that eludes most pilots, it would be the simple basics like how many laps prior to the wingover, and how many laps they placed between maneuvers. Doing your maneuvers in the correct spot.  The simple things like just placing 2 level laps between your maneuvers and the order of the maneuvers is the difference between losing all of your pattern points.

The key is to not let adrenaline get the best of you and not always worry about  how perfectly round your loop or how sharp your corners are. Knowing how long your engine run is and knowing  when the engine is going to quit. Let's just say you've completed your maneuvers and the second you do, the engine quits due to insufficient fuel. The plane now needs to be whipped for 2 laps prior to landing or your landing doesn't count.  For the beginner, judges will overlook this possibly. They certainly will tell you however. Ken

I never thought of whipping it when it looks like an upwind landing is imminent. I know I'll be trying that in the future. Last week made an ugly one where the plane even turned in to face me after it was rolling on the ground. It's always windy at my club field. I think it's one of the highest points on the fort.

Fred, I'm flattered you think I might have the right stuff for combat. I love to watch it, but the sight of it looks impossible to me. I can't believe some of the twists and turns and predicaments they fly into and out of. But I'll talk to some of the combat guys at the meet while I'm there.

http://home.cogeco.ca/~ukeyman/otsmain.shtml

opinions are like elbows...everybodys gonna have a couple.

If you're gonna fly stunt, start with the beginner pattern first, the OTS pattern is cool, but not gonna help learn/fly the AMA Pattern. I've seen you fly, you have the skills and the equipment to be competitive in the beginner/novice pattern.

If I read it right, beginner class does not have a builder of model (BOM) provision, and the other classes simply do not allow scoring of appearance points if the model is not built and finished by the flier. The model will still be permitted, and the event scored.

Sounds like building a Shoestring should be on your list also.

Phil

The problem with combat is, win or loose, you might not have planes at the end of the day...

Just my $0.02.

I really think it is cool what some people can do. My Dad flew control line combat for a while.

Phil

pkrankow wrote:Sounds like building a Shoestring should be on your list also.

Phil

As opposed to rebuilding, like the one I have now.

But in any case, she flew well today. I practiced the AMA Novice pattern. Since the SS isn't an OTS qualifier, I'm blowing that off and sticking to the AMA pattern. My first flight was my usual overexcited rush, and it showed. But I calmed down after that and got good critique from my flying buddy, Wayne. He is a judge for the events that his club sponsors. It sure is easier to concentrate when you have someone to help. My next flights went better, and I got a good portion of the beginner pattern done fairly respectably. After taking the advice Wayne offered, I did better bigger loops and kept all three in the same circle. He insisted I start a little higher, and that helped. My outsides were all on track, but he said they were still too tight. My figure 8s also were of decent shape, but again too small. That seems to be the hardest advice to follow, using all of the air. I wouldn't have believed it after my earlier attempts, but my square loops were today's crown jewel. I did use the full height with those. I didn't do any overhead 8s. My takeoffs were jumpy, but the bumpy grass field makes that difficult. And my landings were no beauty either, though I only nosed over once, and never landed prematurely. So, I'm happy with that. I showed some real improvement.

I wanted someone who knows how a plane of this type is supposed to feel, and Wayne took the controls and flew the whole pattern. Nicely done. He reported that the plane has no bad habits. I was happy to hear that. Now my repair job has the official seal of approval.

I set up the camera, and never gave it another thought, so no video today. I also flew the Baby Flite Streak for some Cox engine run time to log. It was fun, since it's been a while since I've flown a small one, and that Tee Dee .051 continues to be a wonderful screamer. Fast smooth runs and nice clear pink exhaust oil.

So that's my flight report today. I might fly the Streak over at the Church Saturday. Don't know if I'll get the SS out again before next week. I got some new un-bent landing gear for it that I need to put on, and I need to harden the fuse where it mounts. The old gear is compressing the wood. Maybe I'll fill the old holes and put a fiberglass patch over the fuse where they squeeze it.

Rusty

Rusty,

The Yak 9 is OTS legal. Kitted before '52

Just keep in mind the flap penalty if used. Ken

The only trouble is I need to be practicing now, and the Yak still has a long way to go. The wing has been tedious, but the rest should move along more quickly. I'll probably be flying it before the contest, but maybe not soon enough. Maybe if I get good enough with the SS, I'll slide right into the Yak by then. But with the improvement I saw today in my AMA pattern skills, I think I'll be able to compete, or at least feel good enough to try.

I wanted to go more in depth earlier, I had just received an email from De Hill and it highlighted the OTS rules in Tulsa. Over here non flapped gets 20 points and flapped are awarded no points. The Yak was listed as OTS eligible.

I guess find out what you local rules are. I would still go flaps and just practice with the Shoestring. It's only a subtle difference in flight anyway.

Glad you were able to get out and put some laps in. Much more sky with the bigguns, you have been flying 1/2A for so long it only makes sense you do tight loops. I think sometimes I am a bit extreme on my loop size LOL. I have been lucky enough to fly with some excellent fliers and the pointers do help. How often can Wayne be there? I wish someone would take my handle and fly mine. Every time I ask I always get the head shake... 

Ron

I think Wayne is ready to go most any time I want to. His only problem is the 90 mile round trip he has to do to come to my field. Or even more for me to go to his. He lives an hour from my house. But he told me he can go most Tuesdays or Thursdays, and sometimes on Sunday. So barring other business I have to schedule on those days, we should get some time in. I have tree people coming this Thursday, and company coming this weekend, but I should have some time to work on the Yak.

I'm at the point that I need to figure out how to proceed. I'm going to get pin hinges, and I have my white Monokote. So I guess I should cover the main wing so I can de-warp it before I cut hinge slots. The TE is bowed, but the flap pieces are pretty straight. I think I can cut slots just the same through the covering. What are your thoughts on that? I may just paint the flaps white instead of Monokoting them. That'll make them more ding and dent resistant.

If you want to, you can copy the Yak quote and answer it in the Yak thread.
https://www.coxengineforum.com/t5232-yak-9-build-part-two

You can jig the bare wood wing and use a steam iron on it to work out the warp. Leave it clamped in the jig at least a couple days to dry out after steaming. A piece of angle iron would make a good jig.

Phil

pkrankow wrote:You can jig the bare wood wing and use a steam iron on it to work out the warp.  Leave it clamped in the jig at least a couple days to dry out after steaming.  A piece of angle iron would make a good jig.

Phil

You're right, Phil, I think I'll give it a try. I'd feel better if it was straight before covering it, rather than forcing it by shrinking the Monokote.

Rusty, Myself and some other Nashville boys will be at Huntersville this fall to fly combat. Please come by and check us out I will gladly put you on on of my planes to try out. I can send it up a bit fat, if you dont want to go the full 75. But I wouldn't worry about it, I've seen your videos and you can handle it, no problem. I am not worried about you crashing. My planes are very tough and cheap too. Around $22 per plane. Plus I always have some war weary ones that are ready to die anyway. I guarantee it will put a smile on your face. Mike

Okay, Mike, it sounds fun. Thanks for the offer. Maybe I'll be better at than I think. I'll come over to the combat circle and find you.
Rusty